Fram

Editors, Admins and Bureaucrats blecch!
Post Reply
User avatar
Graaf Statler
Side Troll
Posts: 3996
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:20 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Fram

Post by Graaf Statler » Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:36 am

Madam gender wrote:Bottom line, the WMF needs to get its hostile, toxic community under control, as well as the destructive “governance” processes that chew up anyone who gets anywhere close to them. The “community”, including arbcom, is still throwing rocks, back in the inner city, and anyone even halfway competent has moved out to the suburbs, wikidata, wikisource, etc. If they are still around at all, that is. Yas, WMF needs to get control of its process, while it still has one.

Joker. The toxic WMF as the saviour of the toxic wiki community. Again a stupide posting.

User avatar
CrowsNest
Sucks Maniac
Posts: 4459
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:50 am
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Fram

Post by CrowsNest » Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:36 am

Wikipediocracy needs to have a warning for casual visitors - apologies for the sticky floors, some of our regulars just get a little excitable.

:oops:

And another thing, can they not have a sub-forum for the Wikipedians when they want to wrestle, or kiss, or whatever the fuck it is WBG wants to do to Alex Shih?

:oops:

User avatar
Graaf Statler
Side Troll
Posts: 3996
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:20 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Fram

Post by Graaf Statler » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:01 am

If successful in repressing this dissent, it may well break out in the media later on as a successful coverup. There are few things the public hates more than a corrupt charity. ~Swarm~ {sting} 09:37, 12 June 2019 (UTC)

You got it, Swarm. Why do you think I am sitting here for years and years as a cat at a rabbit hole? Most times only looking around, noticing everything.......... Many times I say nothing, I only read and notice.
I am not a stupide fuck and a 150 kilogram pizza eating keyboard knight like Viligiant with his audience of around 25 peeps, no, no, no, I am a cat.
I only observe and wait.......

User avatar
CrowsNest
Sucks Maniac
Posts: 4459
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:50 am
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Fram

Post by CrowsNest » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:50 pm

The usual fare for Gender Desk. Behind the curve, jumps to conclusions not backed by the evidence, hopes for a world that will never exist in a million years, cannot ever bring herself to highlight the obvious - Bishonen is a women too. She is closer to the current idea of what a women Administrator on Wikipedia looks like, not Gorilla Warfare, who in her present capacity is stymied in her efforts far more by Bishonen's equivalent in the Committee, Opabina Regalis, rather than any of the men.

Opabina is the women who has magically just started playing on the fact she is not only a women, but a scientist, as if somehow that makes her bullshit smell any more sweeter. GEE, I wonder why that is? Could it be that with the help of Gender Desk et al, low rent third rate feminists, this has suddenly become wikicode for DON'T HIT ME, I'M A TINY LITTLE WOMEN, and then she sucker punches you with the sexist patriarchy one two.

You know who were women scientists on Wikipedia well before it became not just a media talking point but a magic cloak of invisibility and a mystical wand of virtue? People who didn't particularly need to shout about it for other people who can read the Wikipedia back office properly to see they were genuinely good people with the right ideas about what was wrong and how to fix it? Gorilla Warfare and Keilana. We're taking several years ago now when this was even a thing, and yet still no sign that their failure to achieve lasting reform has dented the ambitions of the WMF much, if at all. How much money do you need to block Eric Corbett for telling two users in a week to fuck off? None. Zero. Nada. It was, is, and on current evidence always will be, a task for a volunteer to react. Or not, as the case may be.

The sad plight of Wikipedia's women Administrators has been known for years, notably from these two. Oh how we were horrified at the sad story of Keilana in her bedroom, crying her little eleven year old eyes out. Some of us showed the appropriate level of sympathy, but also took up the difficult task of asking why her parents didn't know she was being exposed to this abuse by Wikipedia? I wrote about in a forum that went boom, and we didn't see Gender Desk shedding any tears, or wondering why the hyeenas of Wikipediocracy were laughing their asses off.

Some of us are wondering why, even now, after all the recent stories, Wikipedia doesn't get even a hundredth of the scrutiny over how they administer their duty of care for its users compared to Facebook and Twitter et al, never mind Jeremy Kyle. I don't see much on Wikipediocracy about that, because Wikipediocracy is hardly the place where you're going to find such introspection, not when most of the people there are card carrying cult members, indeed many are in the precise volunteer roles which could and should have been pushing the WMF for the necessary changes.

You want to talk about the women of Wikipedia? Plenty of women Administrators, plus TWO women Arbitrators (Opabina, obviously, and Kate), and other high flying women editors (and many prominent male "allies") supported RexxS' bid for Adminship, filed the same week he literally called another editor a "prat". Too many to list here. He succeeded on a literal knife edfe, in large part due to personal friendships (so fuck anyone's online experience of the man, it's not real), and even then only after some crusty old dudes gathered in a smoke filed from to declare civility was unimportant to Adminship. So here we are, Bishonen's right hand man, long time friend of Eric Corbett (as in, actual drinking buddy in Manchester pubs), is all up in this shit now. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think he's really arguing the case that the WMF are in the right? He graciously accepts they think they are, but that's just the typical patronizing bullshit you often see on Wikipedia, every minute of the day.

You want to talk about the real issues faced by the WMF? This comment by RexxS, now possessing the full gravitas of an Administrator, as evidenced by the continuing charmed lives of the likes of Eric Corbett and The Rambling Man, both under specific ArbCom sanctions, is a goddamned dirty lie.
The community endorsed ArbCom's creation of arbcom enforcement sanctions, which effectively ended the issue of "unblockables" quite some time ago.
There was nothing surprising about seeing RexxS the Administrator say this either.....
I can't take this latest statement seriously either. If the fact that Fram said "Fuck ArbCom" was sufficient for T&S to act because ArbCom had a "CoI", then if Fram had also said "Fuck T&S", would they have recused themselves as well? Does this mean that if we all say "Fuck ArbCom; Fuck T&S", we're all safe from being banned? It sounds like we have a simple resolution for this problem: shall I start a page for us all to express ourselves? --RexxS (talk) 20:59, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
.....he is after all the same editor whose request for Adminship revealed his penchant for creative, most would say absurd, arguments to explain away inconvenient roadblocks to his idea of good governance, like ArbCom policy, and copyright (the latter presumably explaining why he admits to having reused with Fram).

Did the volunteer women of Wikipedia who supported this fucknut for high office really do their due diligence of this Administrative candidate? Or did they just phone it in, like the worst volunteer men Wikipedia has to offer? I wrote it all up here.

This actual opening paragraph to an actual proposal tabled by an actual Administrator, this utter bullshit.....
I think we can assume that almost nobody took real offence at Fram's posts which were the stated reason for the ban, otherwise they would have ended up at ANI or ArbCom, so it's likely that most folks on enwiki would have viewed the "fuck ArbCom" post as a bit of venting following a badly worded message from ArbCom. Fram is a highly valued, long term editor and admin, and despite any differences we've had, I fully believe they have the best interests of the encyclopedia at heart, and don't think we should be losing their contributions for a year over a trivial matter. So it's quite understandable that most of us feel outraged at the ban imposed.
......would not look remotely out of place if I just replaced RexxS' name with Opabina Regalis'. Both have a pretty darn loose relationship with the facts, an unnerving ability to just make shit up and use their fantasy land narratives to properly derail time poor Wikipedia volunteers from the already difficult task of figuring out what to do (Fram was categorically not banned for a single angry post to ArbCom, that was clearly just the last straw). One thing connects these two people, the male and female variant of the highly trusted but extremely bad Wikipedian - zero morals. These people aren't stupid, they know they're telling lies, they just know nobody will stop them, penis or no penis.

Wikipediocracy doesn't talk about any of this shit, because for them it would be tantamount to admitting you fuck your cousin. They're up to their eyeballs in the sewer, an integral part of it. This is the reality of Wikipedia that most of them helped bring about, either directly, through action, or indirectly, through cowardice.

The executive power lost control of the volunteer English Wikipedia community a very very long time ago. Some might say it all started with Bishonen, a woman, expressing her OUTRAGE that Jimmy Wales, a man, dared to tell her how she should conduct herself. Fast forward to people like Jess Wade, who only seem to know one thing about Wikipedia these days, this toxic idea that anything bad that happens to you is because of all the penis. This sort of activist driven victimhood is all that the ramblings of Gender Desk has brought about. No wonder then that Wikipedia and Wikipediocracy are obsessed with the idea Fram has been taken out by a woman "victim".

Recent history time. Women are on the Wikipedia Arbitration Committee now, not a fifty fifty split, but enough to make a difference. When handed a golden opportunity to investigate if Jess really was being victimised in the Rama case, if she really was being subject to a sexist campaign to keep her down, they passed. Opabina, she was the sole Arbitrator to actually refuse to even hear a Case about any of it. Neither Katie or PMC wanted to expand the scope to examine Jess' lived experience, or fantasy recollections thereof. The same women passed on the opportunity to examine Fram's conduct in the GiantSnowman case. Opabina, Katie and PMC all flatly refused to even acknowledge Fram's conduct on the record. Quite where Gorilla Warfare is in all this, I do not know, but I have long suspected she often reaches the point where she's just tired of being the only person on the Committee talking sense, and just checks out, focusing instead on her real life career. Can't blame her at all. That's the real institutional sexism of Wikipedia.

If the truth of this Fram matter is the WMF stepping in when community governance has failed to course correct a problem user, an aggressive and abusive Administrator, then whatever you do, however quick your write up, don't pretend like the women of Wikipedia weren't a big part of the reason why they took control, nor obscure the fact Bishonen and her underlings are leading the charge to rebuff it.

The WMF can change nothing, absolutely nothing, this shit is as baked in today as it was the years ago. Jess Wade is symptomatic of how the business model is going to be protected. PR. Set up a parallel cult within a cult where women are instantly believed and protected solely because they are women. They happily work away on bullshit content and recruitment goals that generates good PR but whose success is only measured in anything but the crudest terms (moarr=good), entirely absenting themselves from the great community dramas like this. They talk about the content, not the community, except to throw wild accusations as a transparent attempt to play to the ignorant gallery in the Twitterverse and secure further grant funding.

Protecting Jess Wade from scrutiny, pretending like I'm the sexist asshole, is basically a good way to ensure eleven year old girls continue to suffer horrendous abuse for having been lured by Wade into believing they too can change the world, one article at a time.

You don't send innocent people into a war zone. You don't attack the people highlighting the way things really work in the battle space, as duplicitous so called feminists happily descend to the same level of their so called enemies, on the rare occasions they find it convenient to engage them in battle at all.

Bishonen actually wants credit for trying to stop Fram. She said, "I think you need to stop with the personal stuff." He ignored her. She did nothing. The WMF did something, and now she's apoplectic. That's the most powerful women on Wikipedia today. Is this something that the feminists are fine with? If not, hey, you could, y'know, do something. Four women on the Arbitration Committee. Four. Fram called them incompetent. Hard to disagree with him, given it was their job to course correct him. It's also their job to investigate what Bishonen does. This isn't her first time, wheel warring.

Bishonen vs. The Executive Power, with ArbCom as an irrelevant sideshow. That is, in a nutshell, the real story of Wikipedia governance for the last fifteen years, the backdrop to Wikipedia's toxic culture.

If the feminists can't get ArbCom to be their champion, they can support the WMF here and now. Don't pretend like you're too scared of all the noise to speak up, too afraid of retribution, that's not feminism. They're parking their tanks on your lawn as I speak. Or rather, just rolling them a few miles further into your already rather small enclave that you've worked so hard to build these last few years.

If you want help, listen to me. I'm a feminist. A real one. You won't find me scared of retribution. I am the retribution.

There are greater issues in play too, greater even than a women's basic dignity, namely the clearly unjust nature of WMF's chosen tools, their deceptive talk of fundamental human rights on the one hand and hiding behind contractual chicanery on the other. But don't you worry, we got that too. The advantages of not being single issue activists like Gender Desk and her new best friends the good folks of Wikipediocracy (she loves them, she hates them, she loves them, on and on it goes). We see it all. Everything covered, no issue left behind.

The Tyranny of Evil Men.

Unashamedly targeting the gender traitors of Wikipedia like Bishonen and the fake-ass feminists like Jess Wade like its 2029, or even 1929.

:ugeek:

------------------

Jesus. Talking about this stuff like she's got a clue. The curse of our times. This truly is The Age of Wikipedia.

HTD.

User avatar
CrowsNest
Sucks Maniac
Posts: 4459
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:50 am
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Fram

Post by CrowsNest » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:17 pm

Another woman of Wikipedia, and Wikipediocracy.....
Shall we then ban everyone who swears on Wikipedia? Great, then we will get rid of about 75% of the editors.....99% of those will be male, though, so we might end up with a Wikipedia dominated by.....females....
They care about that imaginary threat, but not this pretty real one....
The fact that LauraHale's identity wasn't kept secret is a secret coup for the godlings of incompetence.

LauraHale's editing career is over.
I would strongly advise her not to attend any wikimania events.
.....posted right before that nonsense.

User avatar
Graaf Statler
Side Troll
Posts: 3996
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:20 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Fram

Post by Graaf Statler » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:46 pm

That posting before was really a great posting, Crow. Special you don't send innocent people into a war zone, there egoistic war zone. The abuse of young kids, people with a clearly mental defect like Ymnes, Bart, it is a scandal.
And shitty woman are just as bad as shitty man, there is not any different for me. I despise them both.

I don't know if I am a feminist, I take every human being the same serious and try to treat them in the way I should like to be treated myself.
The way the gender card is played on Wikipedia is exacte the same dirty as the most shitty man how only drinks and beat his wife and children. These gender bitches, male or female are exacte as dirty as them, there is not any difference. Not any.

User avatar
CrowsNest
Sucks Maniac
Posts: 4459
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:50 am
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Fram

Post by CrowsNest » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:56 pm

Appreciate it Graaf. It is a shallow man that uses a language barrier to beat his enemy with.

User avatar
CrowsNest
Sucks Maniac
Posts: 4459
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:50 am
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Fram

Post by CrowsNest » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:31 pm

Mason_(28_Bytes) wrote:"I know what will help," thought the Chair of the Board of Trustees. "These people who are upset about what we did, I will compare them to Gamergaters. That will be sure to build bridges and promote mutual understanding. Yes, that is exactly what I should do."
WP:DUCK?

COBT wrote:I have had nothing to do with this decision to ban an enwiki admin at all. Office actions do not go through the Board, but even if they did, WMF is aware of any COIs I might have since it is something all trustees proactively disclose. I filed no case against this user and I wasn’t given any prior notification that this was going to happen either, neither did the Board. The bad faith scenario that certain individuals are conjuring up is designed to get people riled up, but it has no basis in truth.

I want to say something else. This community, when confronted with the ban of an admin on the grounds of problematic behavior, instead of examining said behavior immediately turned to find another individual to blame, finally settling on Laura. She has since then been under relentless public examination, with a deep look at her past, the quality of her edits, her being a WiR (in 2013!), her personal relationships, and even people going through Commons and elsewhere to find pictures of her and pictures of me and posting them externally. Her ban (and mine) have been called for – this has no effect for me since this is not my community, but it is de facto what will happen to Laura, since I don’t see how she will be able to continue contributing with say 20+ people following her edits waiting for some kind of error. But even further - this pattern of trying to prove, in order to absolve a banned admin, that there must be either something in her past, or that she must have done something wrong or used undue influence for her own personal gain, is sadly familiar to most women in the internet, and has strong textbook reminiscences of for instance Gamergate. This is not safe. It’s not healthy for this community either. I urge this community to go back to reasonable discussion – one in which there is an honest conversation about the health of this project and how to promote a thriving community, and the role community and WMF can share to ensure this happens.


Everyone, please remember not to say "F*** the WMF Office for its heavy-handed and authoritarian actions seemingly designed to inflame and divide the editing community." That sort of thing could get you banned. Try to find a more civil way of expressing it. 28bytes (talk) 00:55, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
You want press? Here's what you do. Gain a consensus for adding a small banner to the top of the main page for, say, 3 days. Give it a compelling title like "The Wikipedia editing community is under attack. Click here to learn more." Link that to an information page that concisely lays out what has transpired so far, and asks readers to help by signing a petition to the WMF, or contacting the WMF to express their views, or some other appropriate action. One of the many, many journalists who use Wikipedia will see it and click.

....28bytes (talk) 02:15, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
this specific ban appears totally unjustified based on the evidence so far presented...... This really stinks, and needs to be pushed back on with whatever means we have at our disposal. 28bytes (talk) 13:52, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
Often hard to remember that the Wikipedia user Masem, who pushed hard for a reinterpretation of NPOV to let the GGers have their side told on Wikipedia, and Mason, the Wikipediocracy member who got elected to ArbCom (around the time of GG?) without telling the community he was a long time participant at the "hate site".

Anyway, Fram is clean and the ban is bullshit because this is what a loud posse on Wikipedia has declared?

Ethics. Tough stuff. :roll:

In the time they're taking to SCREAM THE HOUSE DOWN, they could have collected at least a summary of all the conflicts Fram has been involved in these last few years, and begun the task of examining his conduct against even their rather lax notions of what is acceptable. Under ArbCom conditions, Fram doesn't survive that. Hence why even the Holy Justices did not want.

But no. Instead, the myth that he was banned for telling ArbCom to fuck off, is by now already well established among the unwashed proletariat and their Local Representatives. Happens every single time when a Vested Contributor (Loyal Worker) faces serious consequences for skimming the collective wealth.

Was this inaction really to give Fram some more WP:ROPE? More time to better himself? Was Bishonen really on his case? Really?

Yank. Snap. Fram's dead. Ooooooops. Sorry. What, you were dealing with this? Oh dear, MY MISTAKE.

The WMF handles this widespread institutional rot how exactly? Other than taking a blow torch to the whole place.

THE ROOF, THE ROOF, THE ROOF IS ON FIRE......

User avatar
CrowsNest
Sucks Maniac
Posts: 4459
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:50 am
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Fram

Post by CrowsNest » Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:39 pm

And in case it literally needs to be spelled out, it’s a big fucking deal that Floquenbeam and Bishonen have fallen on their swords over this. These are not random admins. These are serious pillars of the community who can’t be replaced. ~Swarm~ {sting} 09:54, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
Some animals are more important than others, eh?

HEY DICKHEAD.

Everybody is replaceable.

Bishonen on Jimbo, YESTERDAY......
Incidentally, I can't say I have much faith in Jimbo accomplishing anything in this case. He's quite keen on civility policing AFAIK. Anyway. Bishonen | talk 13:28, 11 June 2019 (UTC).
That's Bishonen, special pillar of the community, still throwing shade at Jimmy for blocking her.many years previously.
Most notably, Floquenbeam and Bishonen, two of our greatest, and most policy-compliant, admins of all time, who have openly rebelled in spite of the revocation of their tools. These are people who gave a great deal to your project. If you want this project to survive long term, you need to start taking the community seriously, right now. Jimbo has taken us seriously since the early days. If the WMF wishes to betray that precedent, then it deserves to be relegated to the ash heap of history.
Oh please. My recollection is Jimmy blocked Bishonen precisely because she was a disgusting animal to whom the notions of community and policy are entirely irrelevant, and a line in the sand regarding Administrator standards had to be drawn.

Bishonen has only two motivations in her Wikipedia life. What she wants. And what she wants. If you've seen anything that contradicts this theory, I want to see it.

This is the first and only time I have seen her sacrifice anything, and yes what a surprise it was not, to see that it isn't anything more noble or more complex than simply to further her long standing view that nobody should have more power on Wikipedia than her.

I will be genuinely convinced she has really fallen on her sword here, if by some miracle the community is prevented from giving her her Administrator rights back, for having so blatantly defied the proper authorities, and justified herself with a characteristically dishonest explanation. And obviously, someone has to actually take them off her first.

Time was, Jimmy would have been the one to remove the Admin rights of anyone who defied an Office action without good reason ('I disagree" not being a good reason). For reasons absolutely tied in to the actions of Bishonen, he had to give up that power.

These days it is ArbCom who has the primary duty under Level II procedures to remove the Administrator rights of Bishonen as of now. A body Bishonen has consistently undermined and openly defied. Is she guilty of "behavior is inconsistent with the level of trust required for its associated advanced permissions"? Clearly yes. She has undone the block that gives effect to a Foundation ban. Did she have a "satisfactory explanation"? No, just some patent garbage about how OFFICE wheel warred.

She has not been desysopped by ArbCom, not because she acted within policy, or policy is somehow unclear. She remains an Administrator precisely because she acted outside of policy, and for reasons that have always defied explanation, is considered above the normal rules and norms that govern the Administrator role.

Any one who goes to the press with this BULLSHIT, is going to be told the truth by the people who know what they're talking about. People who are surprised at the claim she is one of the "most policy-compliant, admins of all time". In case you haven't noticed, everything has does is a matter of public record.

User avatar
Graaf Statler
Side Troll
Posts: 3996
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:20 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Fram

Post by Graaf Statler » Wed Jun 12, 2019 7:30 pm

I don't believe a single fuck of this "spontaneous riot". It is a theater performance. Just as the strange "insulting" and leaking private info about me of vigtroll a a theater performance was.

They fear the Abd Lomax law case and for sure there lawyer has made them clear what happend if I export the whole bloody case to Europe.They want to get ride of T&S, mark my words.
Because it is a potential legal nuclear time bomb, because if that explode there is nothing left of them, and they end up in European criminal law.

Ah, I know them like my own brothers, I recognise there poor bad acting a theater performance from miles away. They should invent themself and find new more unick troll technics, because these are getting boring. Have you see one, you have seen them all.
They are extreem poor liers and trolls, and now ha, ha, ha, is like the snow in the heat in no time complete T&S disappeared and that SanFanBan's too. Stupide autist lies again.

Fits perfect in the lie and troll tricks I have seen the past years.

Post Reply